NFL Running Back Ricky Watters: How Adoption Shaped My Life

Join us for this interview with former NFL Running Back and Super Bowl Champion Ricky Watters. He is an adoptee, an adoptive dad, and author of a new children’s book on adoption, A Gift Called Shane.

In this episode, we discuss:

• How old were you when you learned you were adopted and how did you find out?
• When you discovered you were adopted, you mentioned in your NFL movie that it put a big chip on your shoulder. How has that chip served you well as an adoptive dad? 
• How has it been a detriment?
• Why did you decide to adopt?
• Why did you decide to adopt internationally?
• Did your experience with finding out late that you were adopted affect the way you discussed adoption with your son?
• Do you see any signs of a similar “chip” in your son that you had when you found out you were adopted? How do you help him navigate it for his own success?
• How did you prepare your biological son for the adoption of his brother? 
• How do you support your adopted son in his questions about identity, birth family, etc.?
• Are you in reunion with your biological family?
• How has your adoptive family handled your reunion with your birth family?
• How excited were you for fellow hometown boy Shady McCoy to get into the Eagles Hall of Fame?
• What was your experience with playing at Notre Dame? 

Transcript

Please pardon any errors, this is an automated transcript.

Are you a football fan like I am? And do you love great kids books that help you talk about
adoption, foster care or kinship care, families like ours and related conversations? You are in for
a treat today. We're sharing an archived interview today that I was honored to do with our founding
executive director, Don Davenport, several years ago. We talked with Ricky Waters. He's a former
Notre Dame Fighting Irish wide receiver on the 1988 national championship team. And among many
other accolades, he's also a Super Bowl winning NFL running back. Ricky is also an adult adoptee
who experienced reunion. He and his wife adopted their son, Shane, for whom he wrote this
children's book called A Gift Called Shane. So sit back, enjoy the show and go birds.
Welcome, Ricky, to Creating a Family. We are so glad to have you here. Oh, thank you. Thanks for
having me. I am just as excited about having Tracy Whitney here. She is the voice behind all the
articles, all the tip sheets. She is the heart behind our support groups.
She is also a friend and somebody I have learned a lot from. She also happens,
Ricky, to be your number one fan. She is a huge Eagles fan and a huge Ricky Waters fan.
Fly, Eagles, fly.
This will be especially fun for me because I get to talk with Ricky and I get to talk with Ricky
with Tracy. So I am especially happy. Ricky, Tracy and I are going to share questions,
but I'm going to start. How old were you when you learned you were adopted and how did you find
out? Well, yeah, that's one for the ages right there. I was about nine or 10 years old.
And I know that because I was at the playground, which had this basketball court. three or four
blocks from my home. But it was a place that there's some shady people might be there,
you know, some sketchy people. So I had to prove to my parents that I could go there by myself.
So I know I was there by myself playing at the basketball court. And this guy comes up to me,
he asks about my sister. My sister's name is Rhonda. She's six years older than me. Guys liked her,
let's put it that way, because she was very pretty. So for him to ask about her... It wasn't
anything weird. I said, oh, no, here's somebody else. She's asking about my sister. He's probably
going to say, oh, she's pretty. What's up, man? Won't you help me get a date with her? Yeah, I was
going to say, can you give me an in? Yeah, that's what used to always happen. So I thought for sure
that's what was taking place at this time. But instead of saying that,
he goes, yeah, yeah. Is that your sister? I said, yeah. He goes, and that's not your sister. And I
go, oh, God, what angle is he playing now? You know, this is one I never heard for sure. So he
goes, that's my sister. And I was like, come on, man. You know, I've heard it all,
but I haven't heard that one. You know, and then he goes, look at me and look at look at you.
And who does she look more like? And I was like, wow, because she's lighter skin. She's fair skin.
She has what we call the good hair. So different hair than I had. When he said that,
I thought about that. It kind of came back some of the things that I have dealt with where people
would say to me, you know, if I was out with my mom, my mom had fair skin as well,
looked a lot like how my sister looks. So if I was with those two, they'd say, man, what happened
to you? You know, that kind of stuff. They would joke me different things. So that kind of came up.
But I said, you know what? Nah, I'm going to get my dad, my dad, Big Jim. My dad was a war veteran
and a tough guy that no one in the area wanted to mess with. So I was like, man, I'm going to get
my dad. My dad's going to go down there. He's going to tell this guy off. He's going to tell him,
don't play with my son like that and all that. But when I got there and I talked to my dad and I
said, dad, he said this, this, and I was all mad and everything. And he just, my dad took a big
sigh. big breath and he just like i had never seen him like this he was like at a loss for words
like he'd never at a loss for words he doesn't even talk like that or act like that so i was just
like whoa and he said just my mom was at work at the time so he said wait till your mom gets home
we'll talk about it so i was just like oh gosh yeah so now i'm walking this is kind of like that
spike lee where in the movie where you're moving but you're not walking i felt like that so i went
outside i was trying to i had few hours to myself and to just my feelings in my head and trying to
grasp all this and figure out what is she even going to tell me when she comes. And when she came
home, you know, I was finally happy she was home. You know, I could talk to her, but she started
crying. She didn't obviously like the fact that this was coming up and this was brought to her.
And, you know, did I pop this on her lap? So she was she started saying things like,
you know, wasn't I a good mom? And haven't we been great? And I said, oh, my God, yes. You know, I
can't even argue by anything like that. I, you know, I love my family. I love you guys.
I said, but I do want to know the truth. And what is the truth? And she kind of told me real
quickly. And it was something that after that day, I didn't really bring up anymore because I see
how it made her feel. And they made my dad at a loss for worse. You know, but. If you fast forward
past that, I had people who kind of reached out to me at times during my life.
And even when I was in high school, when I was in college saying, you know, I'm your brother, I'm
your this or that, or I'm related to you. And I'd ask my mom and she would say, no, no, don't deal
with those people. Those people, they're not related to you. You don't have to. So I wouldn't, you
know, respond to them. I just kind of left it. But it was always something that was kind of a
little sore spot for me. So obviously then the people who were saying they were related were
related on your birth family side. Yes, were related on my birth family side. So they knew you were
adopted and that you were related to them. Yes. And then the crazy part was they were in my
hometown the whole time. I even had some people who were my cousin or I've found out now that I
played with. I played with in high school, that I played with in college. I played with even in the
pros. So it was like. Pretty amazing to find those things out, to find out kind of where I really
came from. You know, when we say to adoptive parents that your child should never remember being
told, they should just grow up knowing. This is why. You don't want a child to have,
I mean, that was traumatic for you. Oh, it was so traumatic. And plus, you probably didn't get many
answers because you just shut down the conversation because you could see that it was too hurtful
for your parents. So you probably didn't have any answers and were left just with even more
questions, I would suspect. Yes, without a doubt. When were you able to...
start getting answers? Because at this point, all you knew was a word adopted. I assume you didn't
have a clue as to really what that meant or how it came about. So you were nine with not much
information. How did you start piecing it together? Because it sounds like your parents were not
there to be a resource for you. Well, actually, what happened was my wife helped me out with that.
And I didn't find out or really get some real answers until I was like 32 years old.
It was after I had played in the NFL you know I was successful already and the truth is she asked
me my wife she said you know how do you feel about me finding your your birth parents if I could
you know I kind of feel like that's something that you're missing and I was like oh but I'm
successful already I'm already doing well it's not something that I'm really interested in but as
we went along a little more you know we talked about it again and then she said you know I kind of
did a little digging and I think I might be able to find her. And so I said, oh, if you actually
could, you know, why not? It'd probably be a good thing for me. But I had no idea how good.
Once she did it and I actually did find her, talk to her, see that I had brothers that look like
me. It's kind of like seeing where I come from. I got to understand that they do poetry.
So the fact that. I was a poet that loved doing poetry. It wasn't always a cool thing for me,
but my mom did poetry. Even I had an uncle who taught poetry at the University of Pennsylvania.
So it was poetry's in my blood. So it really helped me with that.
Wish I could have got it earlier because earlier I used to do poetry and guys would be like, man,
oh, you're a poet. Oh, and this and that. And it wasn't until I started doing. rap songs, you know,
all of a sudden it was cool. It was like, oh, that's cool poetry now. Yeah, an acceptable form of
poetry, right? Exactly. Let me pause here to remind everyone that you can send your questions to us
if you would like for us to answer them on our podcast, Weekend Wisdom. It's a short form podcast
where we answer your questions in about five, maybe 10 minutes max. So please send us your question
at info at creatingafamily.org. or the link in the show notes.
We'll get them there as well. So don't forget, send us your questions. And now back to the show.
Thank you for being with us today. I'm not just a huge Eagles fan. I'm also a huge Notre Dame fan.
It's like in my family blood. So my dad knew exactly who you were. He was very excited about this
interview. You mentioned in your NFL movie that when you discovered you were adopted,
it put a big chip on your shoulder. And I'm wondering how that chip has served you well as an
adoptive dad now that you're raising a young man. Yeah, well, in football.
and things like that it really helped me because it made me tough and all this and my dad himself
my dad like I said he was a war veteran he he taught me to take up for myself and you know stand up
for myself and be tough and suck it up when things don't feel good and you know get things done so
that was That was all great. But when you become a dad, some of those things are not the best
thing, you know, so you don't want to have a chip on your shoulder when you're dealing with your
kids and all that. But then also when they would go to those things and they have a little chip or
I see that chip starting to form with them, I was able to help them because I had been there
before. And I know that. It doesn't help you in all situations, even though it helps you a lot in
life to be tough, strong, everything. That's not what you always want to be. It's almost like you
want to be flexible. You want to be soft when you want to or need to be. You just want to have a
balance with it. And I was able to give them more of a balance and an understanding of,
you know, who I am, who they are and what you need to go on. Because one day they're going to be.
dads too, right? And also they're going to be teammates, they're going to be friends, they're going
to be classmates of other people and they have to handle those people accordingly and with respect.
So different chips maybe as they're growing and developing, but because you've got this chip,
you can help them develop the sense to know when is the right time for this chip and when this chip
is not serving you well. Right, exactly. How did adoption influence the chip?
I mean, you said it came because of your adoption. And help me understand the connection between
adoption and you getting the idea that I'm going to power through. I am going to show,
I'm going to prove to everybody who I am and nobody's going to get one over on me, that type of
thing. Yeah, definitely. Because I felt like I had to prove myself. I had to make sure that people
understood that I was worthy. Did you feel less than? At the point I felt less than, what it did
was it made me have to be the best at everything, even in school,
because they put me in Catholic school, which was great. I didn't like it at first because all my
friends were in the public schools and they were going to a different school and they were playing
on different teams than me. It was like, man, you're kind of a sellout or whatever. It's kind of in
the hood. You know, they would say things like that to me. So it didn't feel good that I was at a
different place, but I've come to learn that. That was the best thing they did for me was having me
there because it drove me because I wanted to prove myself at that school that I was smart enough
and I would be in every. spelling bee. I won spelling bees, math bees,
science fair projects. It don't matter what it was. I'm going for it. And I'm going full blaze.
If it's the prettiest girl, I want to get the prettiest girl. I want everybody to know I can get
her. She likes me. She thinks I look good. You know, I don't have to be light skin with the pretty
hair. She knows, you know, I'm a cool guy or whatever. So everything was like that. And even in
sports, you know, it's like I had. I don't just want to be on the team. I want to be the best one
on the team or one of the best ones on the team. If I saw something that was kind of cool and
someone else was doing it, I'm going to learn it and I'm going to figure this out and I'm going to
try to be the best at it that I possibly could be. And I want people to acknowledge that and
acknowledge me. Those things, I think. definitely were good for me because when I look at it,
I mean, I became student council president. I was class president. Then I was the president of the
school, you know, things like that, honor society, different things that I was able to attain. I
know it was because of that because I just was not going to be denied. Did it function as a
detriment to you, this having to always be the best, to be perfect? Is that a burden sometimes?
It was definitely at times a burden. And it could be very tough.
It could be a very tough cross to bear. I'd put it that way. When I'm looking at it,
I'm looking at it in retrospect, you know, hindsight 2020, everything looks much better.
But when I was going through it, it was very tough. And at times I would get confused and when to
kind of back off or when to just. go in there and bust the doors down, you know, and make it happen
and make these things happen. And it also caused me to want to ask questions, you know,
want to make sure things are exactly as I perceive them to be, because so many times I perceive
them to be a certain way and it got changed on me or somehow was not even that at all.
So even to understand what's important and why it's important and what I need to do in those
circumstances. to get the best outcome that I want for whatever situation I'm in.
And it was that because your adoption had been hidden from you. So what you thought was true,
the foundation of what you believe to be true was taken away. And therefore you questioned.
Yeah. Yeah. And it makes you start questioning everything. So you don't want to be that person
either. The question, everything. that will irritate people. I mean, you're asking your coach
questions, you're asking, you know, your teacher questions, you're asking people and it's like, you
want to make sure of what it is that I'm supposed to be doing or how I should be following through
with whatever's going on. And a lot of times they, especially coaches and people like that,
they just, you know, you're a soldier and just do what I said and don't worry about why or what
we're trying to figure out. But I became this intellectual who wants to know exactly why I'm doing
this, what it's going to do for the team. And even I might even say something that I think could be
a little bit better or help us. And that wasn't always taken that well from the coaches and stuff.
I was going to ask how that went over. I'm just going to guess. Lou Holtz was not receptive to
that. Oh, that's a shock.
Let me interrupt this interview for just a moment to ask a favor of you. Will you please,
please, please rate and review this podcast? Whatever app you're listening to it on will have the
ability for you to give us a star rating. And if you're feeling just... would be great if you would
also write a review. Also, tell a friend. That helps us as well. Thank you so much.
And now I'll let you get back to the interview.
So you have two sons, one biological and one adopted. Do you see some of that starting to show up
in your adopted son? And how do you kind of go after it in parenting,
both from your own lived experiences, but also with honor and respect for his journey,
because it's been so different from your journey? You know, we tried to with everything we could as
parents, you know, to help him to not have that chip. And from day to day,
you know, we taught him. to be proud of being adopted and confident. And I think the best thing
that we did was right away, let him know. We let him know that he was adopted. We let him know that
that's important. We let him know that he's special. We told him that we were meant to be.
He was meant to be a part of our family and that it goes both ways. This is a two way street.
It wasn't just what we did for him, but it was also. He was given to us,
you know, and it all came full circle. Why did you decide to adopt? You had a biological child.
Yeah, well, there's something that I always wanted to do. I always wanted to pay it forward. I
always thought of adopting a kid and doing what my parents did for me and how much they helped me.
So I thought it was very, very important. And when I started to date my wife and she felt the same
way, she even expressed that she wouldn't mind adopting a child. And she understood that there are
kids out here that need us. And that that would be obviously a very good thing for us, but a very
good thing for me. And it was. Why did you choose, you did choose international adoption.
Was that something that y'all debated on where to adopt from or what form of adoption,
whether to do foster care or domestic, infant, or international? Well, we knew there were children
here domestically that needed us. And so we felt that that was the best place to start.
And we actually did. And we had a failed adoption that was very hard on my son.
Ricky, because he had always talked about he wanted a brother. And it was just amazing that every
time we, for Christmas, at the top of the list would be little brother.
So he wanted to be the big brother. He wanted a little brother. Not little sister, just only a
little brother. No, he wanted a little brother. So it was unanimous that we all wanted to pay this
forward. We all wanted to do this. So I wanted to make sure that we could do that.
But when that happened, it was a tough situation for him, having a brother and then it not going
through. They found out who I was. It kind of got a little messy because of who I am and
everything. So we still wasn't going to stop because that happened. We had to take a little pause.
But then we found out that other people were going internationally, different things, and they had
a positive experience with that. So we didn't want to. not look at all our options and
possibilities. And once we opened up to that, that's when Jane kind of fell on our lap.
I think what happened was his mother in Korea probably looked at our file and she felt like we
would be the best people for him because he's Nigerian and Korean. And I even found that I'm
Nigerian, which is amazing. I found out after I looked it up. What a coincidence.
It was amazing. It was amazing. And the fact that we... the money and the whereabout and everything
to be able to go there and get him and bring him home. And it's just an amazing story.
The fact that we were able to do that and how we did it. And the fact that we just, we went there
and we got him and it was such a great thing. And it's crazy that my dad,
like my dad, he fought in the Korean war and Shane is from South Korea. And we always tell our son,
you know, Shane, that he, that we knew he was out there somewhere. And we just need to find him.
So that's the whole thing that we keep telling them. You know, we could have never imagined
adopting Shane would bring us so much joy, but he made our family complete. There's no doubt.
You know, like I said, it goes both ways. It's like, of course, we, you know, we're there for him
and we gave him the love that his mother obviously wanted for him. And she knew that he wouldn't
get there, you know, in Korea. And so it's just amazing being able to do that.
To go there, like I said, and to see him and to hold him. You know,
he put me in a baby Bjorn. You know, they had one of those and they put him in there with me. And I
had my chain on and he loved my chain. So he was playing my chain and just that feeling and the
acceptance, you know, of him. And it's a story to itself, you know, and that's why I guess it
became this children's book. Yeah. Yeah, I wanted to talk with you about your children's book.
So tell us about A Gift Called Shame. Yeah, A Gift Called Shame is a book that I,
it wasn't a book. It was just poetry. And I wrote it for my son,
my oldest son, Ricky, at the time I wrote it. And I wrote it through his eyes. So it was how he saw
the whole process. And I wanted him and Shane to have something that they could look at.
whenever they wanted to, to kind of commemorate this time and this joyous occasion.
But the fact that it has become a book is just amazing. And I think that has happened because
anytime I would read it or we'd say it or someone would hear it or talk about my poetry and they
would see that. They would go, oh, my God, this is awesome. Like, like, this is needed. Like, I
should get this stuff out there. And I had no idea of how to get it out at the time, except for,
like I said, rap music or something. But I'm not a rapper. So it's like, you know, I'm a football
player. So how's that going to happen? But the greatest thing was when someone told me, they said,
there are no books out there on this. Really, the books that they have are books that are like.
They're animals. So it's like the turtles with the ducks or whatever. And they kind of explain it
that way. So it's nothing, especially a mixed marriage like ours, different races and all the
things that come into that and how to do that in a positive manner that is on the level of a child,
you know, that a child can understand is a hard thing. But they thought that you somehow did it.
And once we put the animation with it. Once that happened, it just like took on the life of its
own. And it's just so amazing. And I'm so excited about how it's been received. Everyone's just
like so excited about it, as excited as I am. So, I mean, I just can't even say enough about it.
Yeah, being an author is cool. Yeah, it's really, it's really cool. And people really like it.
And they're like, oh, it's so poetic. And I'm like, thank you, because that's what I want to be,
you know, a poet as well. You know, but the fact that I could do that and put it on. the terms that
I was able to and to do it the way I did so that anyone can look at this.
And you don't even have to be somebody who's in these situations to understand this book or to feel
this book or to feel the love of a family and a family coming together like we did and all the
dynamics of that family and how it made us so strong. We lost our first child and then Ricky came.
So we feel like. It was still kind of a missing piece there. And Shane filled that piece right in.
And every day, I mean, this guy, when we wake up in the morning, he greets me with a hug.
I greet him with a hug. That's how we do. Whenever we see each other, even if we've seen each
other. That whole day, every time we see each other, he's putting his arms up when I'm walking by.
He's going to give me a hug. I'm going to give him a hug. That's how close we are. And it's just
such a super awesome feeling. Because there are times when he opened up to us and said to us,
I don't feel worthy of being in this family. And I'm glad he said it because that was something he
was dealing with. He wasn't showing it. He didn't show it. So we wouldn't have known that that was
really going on with him. So for him to expose that and to say that and for us to be able to then
start dealing with that and helping him through that and letting him know that, of course,
you're supposed to be in this family. You made our family complete and you are no different than my
biological son. There's no difference. I see no difference in them. I don't treat them differently.
What was even better than all of that to me is how good of a big brother Ricky was to him.
Ricky, he took so much pride in being a big brother. He was like more of a big.
A little big dad. I used to call him. I'm like, oh, you're the little dad. I'm the big dad and
you're a little dad. Because he would just take him by the hand. It's okay, buddy. Don't touch
that. That'll burn you. You know, that can hurt you. All these things, he would always be with
them. And you don't want to do that over here because that can hurt you. Even when Shane wasn't
feeling good at nighttime or something or something happened, once he could walk and get out and
move and go to another, he would go to Ricky's room. and sleep with him. So it was like he never
came to us hardly. He went to Ricky more than he would come to us if he didn't feel good,
which is just super because Ricky has never closed the door on him. Now they're 17 and 24 and he's
still, you know, he needs to come in there. He needs to talk to him. He knows. The door is always
open to you. You're always welcome. You're my brother. I love you. I will do anything for you. And
it showed from day one, from day one to now, they're so close. And if they have something that's
going on or somebody's not, they can, they talk it through themselves first. And if they can't talk
it through, then they bring it to us. So, but it's great. It's great that they bring it to us, but
it's also great that they can handle a lot of things themselves. I can relate to a lot of that. I
have two adopted daughters and then four biological children. And there are very unique
relationships between the siblings that same kind of nurture and care. exists between them.
You mentioned that one is 24 now and one is 17. So 17 is its own beast,
I know. But when you were preparing Ricky for the adoption of a little brother,
what were some of the things that you look back on now and you say were really successful things
that you did to help him get ready for being a big brother and welcoming a child to the family by
adoption? Yeah, well, like I said, it was there wasn't much I had to say for Ricky to get him ready
because he was ready. He just couldn't, especially after we had the failed adoption. So he was just
kind of hurt and crushed by that. And so, of course, after that, once we said,
oh, you know, there's another baby or whatever. We didn't want to get soaps up high or whatever.
But once we found out that we were possibly going to look into this young person, then he was all
for it. He was so. excited and everything. We really didn't have to do anything as far as dad's
concerned. But what was really important to me was us as parents to make sure from day one,
he knew where he came from, that he had pride in where he came from.
He has a Nigerian flag in his room. He has a Korean flag in his room. He has Nigerian things.
He loves Korean food, Korean everything. We don't make it In any way,
like we're trying to get him away from who he is or away from where his roots are and all that.
It's all about that. And we even took him back. And that was the best thing. We took him back and
he was able to see the hospital where he was born, the people who cared for him.
He even had a foster family for a little while. And when we took him back. His foster mother and
sister were there. So he got to see them, got to talk to them. They cried and,
oh, they said, you're so handsome and all these different things to him. And you could just see him
growing with everything that has happened. He was growing. You know, many of his nurses,
his social workers, I was trying to think of everybody who was there. You know, the staff was still
there. It was just amazing. And so many loving memories for him. You know, when we took that trip
back. You just can see it did a lot for him. And I'm so glad that I wouldn't have known to do that
if I didn't have the situation that I had where I didn't kind of get that closure early.
I didn't get that feeling of it's okay, you know, that you're adopted. Nothing's wrong with that.
There's nothing, there's no stigma. I never want him to feel like it's a secret. And I even told
him, I said, I hope I'm not going overboard the other way because I would tell people, oh, yeah,
my younger son's adopted. And I was like, if you don't want me to say that so much, I won't. But at
the same time, I don't want you to ever feel that that's some secret that we're trying to keep and
we don't want people to know about it. And he has embraced it. At first, he didn't because he's
just one of those people in general. He doesn't want the spotlight all on him and everything. And
he didn't even want to talk at first. He was like, it's really funny because he used to watch
Curious George, if you know that cartoon. He's going, and all that. He would say that to us.
We'd say something. He'd go, uh-uh.
and all that so but it's so cute how he's evolved and even when we would take him to the playground
or whatever he wouldn't want to get down he wouldn't want to go with the other kids if a kid's
talking to him right here he'd just be looking straight not even you know looking at the kid or
anything so he doesn't want that kind of thing but as he's gotten older I mean now he makes
speeches he's a leader he's in a leadership team for his school he's one of the leaders in all of
these situations now and he's so well adjusted that we can't even believe it now but I think it's a
lot of that is because of how we formed this whole thing and how we structured it how we dealt with
it I think that it really helped him and he's was able to come out of his shell and be the guy who
he is right now and he now he likes it and now the book's out you know we thought god if this book
comes out he's gonna probably hate it so but we wouldn't do it without asking him how he felt about
it and he's totally different about it Thought it was great. And when it came out, he said all his
friends were saying, man, it's so cool how much your parents love you that they did a book about
you. It's so cool and how it looks like you and all that kind of stuff. So, man, that is the best
for me. It's already a success just because of that, you know, because he has embraced it.
He loves it. He really seems to be like. really cool in who he is and knowing who he is.
And at times, of course, he's going to still feel these little things. He's a tennis player now.
I call him a tennis star and all that because he's a star in my book. But even when he's playing
tennis, at times he says he'll hear that voice or something that kind of tells him.
You're not as good as your dad or you're not going to be this or you're not going to be that. But
then he we work with him on that and we help him through that. And we talk about it each time.
And he has gotten more and more comfortable in that in that space and being out there. And he
didn't even want us to come watch him. You know, that kind of stuff. He didn't want his family to
come, his friends, cousins and everything to come and watch him. But now. He's totally fine with
that. That's a great segue to the next question that I had for you. How do you support him when he
does have those questions or when he does have those kind of niggling feelings about maybe I'm not
good enough or I don't fit in here? How do you support him and learn the skills to cope with those
feelings that he's got going on inside? Yeah. When I talk to him, I mean, first of all,
he has little things, you know, like he has this bag that.
came with him. And there's little things in there, everything about where he, little things he used
to play with, things that he liked. And he loves this bag, which is awesome. Even to this day, he
loves the bag and he'll pull out certain things. So we'll talk about the bag. We'll talk about
where he's from or whatever. We'll talk about Nigerian people in general. You know, they're really
intelligent people, right? They're really prideful people, strong. Same thing with Korean people.
They're the same, you know? And it's like, we watch all the Korean stuff. So he loves how. the k
-pop and all the stuff that they do so i think that that is very important going back to the roots
every time you know i don't want to just say do it because dad says so or do it because this is how
you're supposed to be and how you're supposed to act you know you can you can say all those things
you can say all the right words and all that kind of stuff but you always got to go back to what is
the issue where are you feeling that or whatever but it's tough anyway it's tough for my older son
Because of who I am and being in this family that is so dynamic. And my wife is an attorney.
She's been she's so successful as well. And just the pressure already is there.
Yeah, it would be. Yeah. And so I just talk about what is authentic to him, you know,
and what is authentic to me. And we work around that. And it works out.
It works out really good because he he'll open up the best thing. All I'm really trying to do is
get him to open up. That's all. What are your feelings? You know, what's going on right now? Did
you have a good day in school? We talk every day. I used to drive him everywhere. Now he's driving
himself. But I used to drive him and I used to say that was the best time that I would have with
him is when I could just sit with him. It's just me and him. And I could say, man, how's your day
go today? And, you know, at first you get the. The one that everybody gets, fine. You know,
exactly. But then knowing the situation and understanding the situation,
I would dig a little deeper and ask a few more questions. And all of a sudden the real thing comes
up. Right. So there's that where we're in the car and I'm asking him to get things out of him.
And then we would talk about any of those issues. And I would just, all I have to do nowadays is
kind of just reinforce it. It's already there. So we just reinforce it. But then there's the other
times where he comes to me. And it's like I've learned not to jump on the first thing he says or
not to start talking right away. Because a lot of times he'll say something that's not even really.
what he wants to talk about. That's not really what's bothering him or whatever the situation is.
He'll talk about something light or funny or something to happen. And then I'll laugh with him. And
then now he'll say something else. And then all of a sudden, it's like the third thing normally
that comes out is the thing he really is worried about or really afraid of or really wants to
discuss with me. And so now I've learned to be very patient with him when he's talking to me and I
listen more than I talk. And then once he stops, then I know he's done.
And then I can talk. Easier said than done, isn't it? That's so hard. I tell you, I felt like I was
like double Dutch, you know, it's like the ropes are going and I'm ready to jump in at any point.
Yeah, come on. Let me get in the game. That's a great analogy. I swear,
I felt, I always felt like, huh? But then I'd like learn to just stay back, calm, relax,
let him talk, let him say what he wants to say. Let him get to even the point. And once he did that
and I started doing that, it really helped me with him because now I can just say I don't even have
to say as much as like I would have had to say more if I jumped in right away. But now it's like he
made his point. He's so well spoken and articulate with it, too. So you know exactly.
He's not one of those people who you kind of trying to figure out what he's saying. And what do you
mean by that? And you have to keep asking these things. You know what he means and you know what
he's saying. And he's very articulate with it. And then I can just tell him. And I always start
from a standpoint of what I went through. Yeah, that helps. Dad was scared,
too. Dad used to be scared of the dark. You know, stuff like that. And he'd go, oh, you were, too?
Yeah, I was scared. You know, this and that. That's how I got through that, though. And this and
that. And all of a sudden, he's smiling. He's happy. He's gone.
He's ready to go. He's on with his day. That's the awesome part. Let me pause here to thank the
Jockey Being Family Foundation for their support of both this show as well as the nonprofit
Creating a Family in general. We really couldn't do it without them. And part of their support
allows us to bring you our free courses. These courses are really, they focus on parenting. So they
could be used if you're an adoptive parent or a foster parent or a kinship parent. If you're a
foster parent and you need CE credit, you can get CE credit for these as well. There is a
certificate of completion. So check it out at bit.ly, B-I-T dot L-Y slash J-B-F support.
That's bit.ly slash J-B-F support. And now I'll let you get back to Ricky.
I want to switch now to talking going back because I wanted to touch on reunion because you
mentioned that we were 32 when you and your wife, or maybe your wife and you more,
did the search. Are you in reunion with your biological family now?
I'm not right now because, I mean, it just got messy. You know, I'm glad I found her.
You know, I found her when I was retired. I found her. I was able to... see where i come from like
i said i was able to understand why i have some of these things that i have which are right i now
see as great you know it's great that i do poetry it's great that i was i'm so strong she's she's
real she's a fire plug you know i mean she's real tough and everything my biological mom and uh i
like that yeah but it was just they're in the same city my adoptive parents and my biological fam
so it was just like two families you know i don't You know, it just got a little messy. Yeah,
a little complicated. How did your adoptive family handle your decision to search,
knowing that you were in contact with her? My adoptive family, I mean, mostly my mom wasn't too
excited about me, you know, finding my birth mother and family. My biological mother,
she was really young at the time that she had me. And so her mom, who would be my grandmom,
worked with... my mom who raised me. And so they kind of got together and made it happen.
So I don't, I'm glad, like I said, that it happened. They put me with the right people, however
they figured it out. They put me with the right people and they did really good by me.
I think that when you look at my dad being the tough guy that he was,
I needed that. And I needed him to taught me how to fight, taught me how to do all these things.
What he couldn't. Because he was a wounded war veteran. He stepped on a landmine,
blew half his calf off. So he couldn't really run with me and do those things. But he got the kids
in the neighborhood to do it. They were like three or four years older than me. He did not care.
But I'm glad he did it because it made me always was trying to play catch up with these guys, you
know, where I could show what I could. do you know when you have a dad who had a purple heart i
mean he had all these bronze stars and all these different things it's kind of like he was a tough
guy yeah yeah so you gotta be tough you gotta be tough but my mom had that other side that i needed
too She was the more nurturing one, the more like, oh, it's OK, sweetie. You know,
you didn't get it this time. You'll get it next time. You can be anything you want to be. You can
do anything you want to do. Those type of things, the same things I tell my kids now. You can be
anything you want to be. You can do anything. Sometimes I feel bad about because I'm like, oh, God,
but I don't want you doing that. You could get hurt because my older son, he's a daredevil. And
he's like, you told me I could do anything. I said, yeah, but you don't need to do everything.
Okay, now I'm going to turn it over to Tracy. I promised her an opportunity to geek out a little on
your sports history. Take it away, Tracy. So in True Confessions,
I first heard about you when you were playing for Bishop McDevitt. Yay! I lived in McHenry. Yeah,
I went to Messiah College just across the river. And so that's how I heard about you.
Wow. But I just was... You know, as an Eagles fan, go Birds.
Yeah. How excited, because I know Shady McCoy went to Bishop Devitt also. So how excited for you
that he got inducted into the Eagles Hall of Fame last month? Oh, my God. So excited for him.
Such a great guy. Just having somebody like that who is so talented. When I met him,
he was just like starstruck. on me you know and he's looking at me and he's just like yes sir yes
sir I'm like you don't have to say sir or anything but seeing somebody like that and somebody who
looked up to me like he did said he patterned his game after me all this kind of stuff man I mean
you cannot there's not a better thing that you can tell me but to see him do it himself and to go
on and play the way he played and to go I mean The guy broke all my records at McDevitt.
Then he broke my records at Philadelphia. I told him, I said, you got to stop breaking my records,
man.
But the truth is, man, I am so proud of him. So happy that it was him who did it.
And the fact that he has gone into that, he deserves it. He deserves it so much. Just a great young
man, human being. And we still talk from time to time. And he's like my little brother,
you know, so I'm very, very excited about him. That's awesome. And I do have to ask,
was playing for Notre Dame like a spiritual experience? Oh,
it's amazing, man. It's like a little pro team, really. I mean, just everywhere you go,
people know you because you play for Notre Dame. You're on TV every week. And people are very
passionate when it comes to Notre Dame. They either hate them or they love them. It's no little
bit. It's either you love them or you hate them. But most people I know. Of course,
probably what people would tell me, they love them. But it was a great, great experience for me.
Some of my best friends and my closest friends are guys that I played with at Notre Dame. We're so
close. We were a family. We cried, you know, bled, sweat, everything together.
And it's just awesome to be on a team like that, especially a team that went 13-0 with the crazy
schedule we had and all the... The amazing teams that we were playing against, Miami and Michigan
and all the teams that are still great now. They were great back then. And we were playing Penn
State. I mean, it was like every week we were playing somebody tough. For us to start out in the
beginning of the season, you know, where everyone thinks they have a chance in the beginning, but
to actually go through it. And, you know, a lot of things can happen. You can get injured. Anything
can happen to, like, derail your season. For us to stay together like we did, for us to see it
through like we did, and to go 13-0. and to win a national championship. I mean,
it's still one of the highlights of my life, definitely. Yes, I agree. And Tracy's as well.
Well, Ricky, thank you so much for being with us today. The book is called A Gift Call Shane.
We recommend it to people. Go out and get this book. It's a wonderful book and we truly appreciate
your time today, Ricky. Thank you. Oh, thank you. Thanks so much for having me.